Kevin Grevioux Interview

Kevin Grevioux, co-star and co-write of Underworld poses for Twenty Seven and a Half Photography.

It all started with a meeting with publicist Liza Anderson. Liza is a good publicist and, unusual as it may seem, a good person too. I was sitting in her office in 2004 chatting with her while attempted to convince […]

by Chris Neumer

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It all started with a meeting with publicist Liza Anderson. Liza is a good publicist and, unusual as it may seem, a good person too. I was sitting in her office in 2004 chatting with her while attempted to convince me that I wanted to interview former NFL player-cum-actor, Terry Crews. Crews had attended school in Kalamazoo, Michigan (as I had) and had gotten his big break playing a gay gangster. It seemed like it could be interesting, so I took the interview with Crews and was blown away by how well it turned out. Though it would have been easy to write off Crews based upon his smaller parts and sculpted physique, his real story was fascinating. Screening Underworld, I quickly took notice of two things: Kate Beckinsale’s leather pants and actor/screenwriter Kevin Grevioux.

Like Crews, Grevioux (pronounced Gree-vee-us) is a muscular black guy with several co-starring roles in action flicks to his name. Based off of my extremely positive experience in dealing with Crews, I quickly tracked down Grevioux to do an interview. Suffice it to say, Grevioux has an even more interesting back story than did Crews. Not many other actors can talk of their experiences working at the National Institute of Health or about writing their own parts into popular comic book films as Grevioux can.

Though you wouldn’t necessarily know it from looking at Terrance Gold’s Green Mile,” and you keep on walking.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: You know what, that’s only happened one time. Like I said, I’m only 6’2″; I’m not as big as Michael. So they might say, like you say, somehow I thought you’d be bigger. So, they’re kind of used to that, so they don’t expect Michael to be as big as he actually is. But he is big; he’s 6’5″. So he’s a legitimately big guy.

CHRIS NEUMER: Yeah. It also seems like it taps into something, I was thinking of the perception of you. You’re huge. My biceps are living vicariously through your wrists. I admire what you have done, creating, literally, your body of work, because there’s no way in hell I could ever do it. I’ve got long 36 inch, lanky arms, and I can’t do anything with them. But I was curious to know, you’ve got this deep voice, hearty laugh, you’re this big strapping guy. It seems like there would be a perception of you that’s incredibly different from the real you.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: I guess there is, but I get that a lot, that comes with the territory. When I was working with a microbiologist at NIH, here I have my degree in Microbiology, and I am under a hood looking at cells and someone will come in and say, why aren’t you playing football? It’s like, I have a degree. Obviously I’m academically oriented.

CHRIS NEUMER: Did you ever play football?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, but I never played past high school, and I entered college only weighing 165 pounds.

CHRIS NEUMER: Wow.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: (Laughs) Yeah, so I got a growth spurt and gained 50 pounds of muscle.

CHRIS NEUMER: Ok, what happens when that happens in baseball, I’ll tell you I know what you were doing in the locker now. What was the motivation for you to keep yourself going?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: If I were to be a skeptic, I’m still always going to keep in shape.

CHRIS NEUMER: Yeah, well there’s in shape and then there’s you.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: But I’m not that big though.

CHRIS NEUMER: Oh come on.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: I’m not though.

CHRIS NEUMER: What do you bench now?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: That’s hard. The most I’ve ever benched is 420 or something. But I wasn’t doing it for football, I was doing it for my own personal gratification, and because I could.

CHRIS NEUMER: Gotcha.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: So now, I don’t bench too much anymore. There was a time I worked out recently relatively regularly, and I benched 375 pounds, but why?

CHRIS NEUMER: If you’re ever trapped under a car, you’re going to be ok.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: But if I’m not playing football for the Minnesota Vikings, so why? So that’s my whole thing. Also, it’s part of being a kid, what kid reading comic books doesn’t want to be a big, strong superhero?

CHRIS NEUMER: Yeah, but with superheroes the muscles are in the suits. I’m trying to figure out what the most I’ve ever benched is. Now the bar is 45 pounds. I played Division 3 for college basketball, and during that time I must’ve benched 145 pounds, the most in my life, period. I know I killed myself doing that, and you’ve done three times that, I think?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, but I was a growing boy.

CHRIS NEUMER: Yeah, I’m just giving you a little bit of a hard time.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: That’s all right.

CHRIS NEUMER: I was also wondering, sort of going along with the perception of you, in the other world you’re probably a bad ass. When you’re out there, and you pull those things out of your chest, and they digitally altered your voice slightly, didn’t they?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: No, not at all.

CHRIS NEUMER: No? Wow, I thought there was at least a little bit of digital altering.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: People say that too, and I wonder why? I have no idea why.

CHRIS NEUMER: I was just trying to think, what if you took that persona that you bring forth onscreen and applied that to getting a table in a restaurant.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: I’d get shot, or they’d call the police. You’re supposed to pick up guys like that. When I used to work as a bouncer in a nightclub, you would have mostly problems with the little guys, more so than the big guys.

CHRIS NEUMER: I read in another interview you did that you didn’t necessarily mind being typecast. So then I started wondering about this. It seems as though whatever you’ve been typecast as has been contained within a relatively small opening. What do you think is the next step for you where you sort of break out a little bit from the mold? Where do you go from here?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: To be honest, that’s what my writing is for. I have my writing as a catharsis, for that other side of it, for the fun part. That’s why I came out here. I did not come out here to be an actor. I ended up falling into that because of the physicality that you mentioned, so it’s like, this is fun, it’s cool, and you can make decent money.

CHRIS NEUMER: We’re talking about the acting stuff.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, exactly. Why can’t I do that while I’m writing? I get better at writing, work on my craft, and it all came together with Underworld. So I was able to write myself a part and play it. Fortunately I found a good guy in Len Wiseman, who gave me the opportunity and it worked out.

CHRIS NEUMER: I liked the part about how you couldn’t make the part too big because then they would’ve brought in a rapper. As soon as you said that I tried to imagine Ludacris in the role, this wiry, skinny guy in this role, and it was kind of funny.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Exactly, and that’s what happens sometimes.

CHRIS NEUMER: That would’ve taken on a different role though.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Right. But to me, the writing is where the real moola is. So I don’t mind being typecast as an athlete. My voice may even prohibit me from doing certain kinds of roles, and as an actor you understand that. You could have a guy who’s 6’4″, good looking, well-built, and he could be 42 years old, but they’re not going to cast him as a father. He doesn’t look like what America thinks a father looks like. He doesn’t have a belly, he’s not balding, there’s not gray hair.

CHRIS NEUMER: There isn’t anything wrong with that.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Hey look, I’m bald! But, they look at that as typical, so you get a guy who’s having a hard time finding work, and he’s in his 40’s, why, because they don’t see him as a father. He doesn’t look like a father he looks like he could still play the NFL. They also say he can’t be a doctor, even though, how many people that are doctors right now used to play college ball, and also, NFL ball, there are a lot of them, or at least a few. Robert Smith, who played with the Minnesota Vikings, he has his degree in chemistry.

CHRIS NEUMER: I’m sure, knowing what I know about him now, I’m sure he’s trying to create some new medication for himself that’ll make him normal. Is there ever a sense, I mean, I know screenwriting is where the real you lies, but your acting is also getting bigger, you played a character that had name this time as opposed to “thug”.

 

KEVIN GREVIOUX: (Laughs) or henchman.

CHRIS NEUMER: It seems like, and I don’t want to say you shouldn’t look a gift horse in the mouth, but you really stood out in Underworld. There’s a reason I’m here talking to you. You and Michael Sheen had a presence, and that’s something you either have or you don’t. You guys had it. Scott Speedman was good and all.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Right, he was very good.

CHRIS NEUMER: But when I think back on it, I think of Kate Beckinsdale’s pants, you and Michael Sheen.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Right. Of course I’d like to do other roles.

CHRIS NEUMER: So sort of tying the two together, I know Lisa had said you’re writing something, is it the Pale Rider?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: The Pale Horse Rider.

CHRIS NEUMER: The Pale Horse. Is there anything about that you can divulge on the record?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Not yet. I don’t feel comfortable doing that yet, it’s not at that stage, so I have to wait on that one. But I am developing some stuff now that I’ll be acting in as well as writing and producing. That’s where the real art is, to me.

CHRIS NEUMER: Producing?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: No, writing, for me. That’s why I got into this business. So, I know I have a presence on screen, but even though it’s limited, I really don’t mind it because I get to work with so many cool people, and I’m having fun.

CHRIS NEUMER: Now I’m not asking for names here, but I just want a perspective. Are there people who you’ve met who it isn’t cool to work with? Like, if I find out he or she is working on this project, I’m not on it, I’m stepping away.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Believe me, I haven’t done a whole lot, but I have not run into that. I’ve heard of it, about a lot of that stuff, but I haven’t experienced it personally yet. I’ve had nothing but good things to say about the people I’ve worked with, it’s been really fun. But you know, there’s also a sense that when you do see people act like that, they’re under a lot of pressure, and a lot of people have been told for years, “You’re not going to make it, you’re no good,” blah, blah, blah. Things you probably didn’t hear, so it’s like, “What are you going to say now?” Sometimes people will come up to you, and they want to get with you on your side now when they weren’t there before.

CHRIS NEUMER: Oh, I can’t tell, but it’s upwards of ten now, how many times – and it only happens in LA. I’ll be introduced to a pretty good-looking girl, 20-something-year-old girl, and she’ll be looking away, and then somebody will say to her, “So did Chris tell you he writes a national film magazine?” Suddenly, she’s like, “Oh…” Keep on going baby.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: That does happen a lot.

CHRIS NEUMER: When you talk about them not being on your side, and then you start gaining some success and notoriety, and then they’re asking you what’s going on. I just remember Chris Rock’s comments, “Look at these rocks, beotch!”

KEVIN GREVIOUX: You try not to be vengeful in that way.

CHRIS NEUMER: You try? That’s funny, because I don’t think you’d ever do it.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Exactly. But there were girls you might’ve dated, and their mothers were like, “Oh, it’s a crapshoot.” Then you make it, or you do something everyone sees, and with one swoop, that image onscreen, and they’re wrong, you see. It’s hard not to take a jab, but as a bigger man, you don’t do it.

CHRIS NEUMER: A bigger man, it seems like there’s a joke right there.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: (Laughs) the thing is, don’t take the bait. That’s the way you have to look at it, because there’s plenty of that.

CHRIS NEUMER: It seems like as you mature too. Not mature as a person, but mature in the industry, you keep learning how to do that more and more.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah.

CHRIS NEUMER: And sort of laughing at the people who do flip back and forth.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Exactly, and it’s sad but that’s the nature of the beast, and you have to deal with it.

CHRIS NEUMER: Might as well accept that it’s there.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, and I understand that. But it’s hard to deal with when they act like they never said those things, and they don’t realize. Well, maybe they do realize how hurtful it is. Before you come out here, it seems like such an unreachable goal or dream, that everyone says, “Yeah, ok.” I told a friend of mine years ago, never tell anyone you’re doing this, and I said that because, they’re not going to understand what you’re talking about, especially if it sounds lofty. And then, he went ahead and did it, and of course, they said, “Oh yeah right, whatever, keep dreaming.”

CHRIS NEUMER: His name was George, right?

 

KEVIN GREVIOUX: (Laughs) “Keep Dreaming,” people don’t realize how painful that is. But when you make it, then all of a sudden they act like they never said that.

CHRIS NEUMER: Or they rationalize that they said it because it was in your best interest.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, exactly. It’s like, how do you know what’s in my best interest?

CHRIS NEUMER: Now, you’d mentioned this earlier, and you’d said that you had a goal in mind. I came back to this, because you mentioned that you’re not supposed to tell anyone your dreams, which I also assume are your goals. You said you had one major goal that you were working towards. Without fear of me laughing at you, or telling you to get out of here, what is this goal that you’re driving towards?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Just to be able to tell good stories, and have them reach the screen, that’s my goal. A lot of that was reached with Underworld, but I want to be able to do more of that, I want to be a creative force. I guess if I had to hold someone in high esteem it would have to be George Lucas.

CHRIS NEUMER: Circa 1981?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Whatever the case may be, he has still influenced. There’s George Lucas, Spielberg and Stanley, and those guys are creative fantasy forces. You would be hard pressed to find guys who have done what they have done, not only in terms of what they have created, but what it has meant to the culture, and that’s difficult.

CHRIS NEUMER: George Lucas pained more people from 1989 on than any other film maker at all.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: But you know what, man, you can’t judge the guy. I’m not going to judge him on his recent work.

CHRIS NEUMER: Well, let’s go ’86 and say Howard the Duck, or ’84.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: But what does Star Wars mean to us? I’m going to say us.

CHRIS NEUMER: Well, I’ll grant you that, because it means so much to us, and the new ones have landed with such a resounding clunk.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah.

CHRIS NEUMER: I think that if we didn’t care, if we were just like, “Well, I don’t care what you’re doing,” then I’d probably go ahead and do that.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, man, but they were so fun.

CHRIS NEUMER: They were, the first –

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Three.

CHRIS NEUMER: Two and a half? Wow, we’re on the same page.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, but still, I just thought they were great. And then Spielberg, and maybe I shouldn’t say this, but I actually liked Close Encounters more than Star Wars. That affected me more, I was like, “This is crazy!” This is cool, I mean even the aliens, looking at them, I thought they were great, they were crazy. I loved that stuff. And with Indiana Jones: Raiders of the Lost Ark, that was just a bomb movie.

CHRIS NEUMER: Let me ask you this off-topic. You’re a science guy, you’re a Sci-Fi guy. You mentioned the aliens in Close Encounters. Do you ever find that all interpretation of aliens are always in the same kind of human form, only their heads are a little bigger, their eyes are a little bigger?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: By that, do you mean humanoid, or like Star Trek, or do you mean the alien grey types?

CHRIS NEUMER: I mean they have the same basic body shape as most people. I majored in Anthropology; you see how close I came to that. But when you take a look at the evolution of things, you’ve got weird fish that shoot things out of their foreheads, and it all basically came from the same one cell, and branches off in all these different places. I always find it interesting that you have this alien from another planet, a different environment, with different needs, yet it looks surprisingly like a humanoid from here, it even has four or five fingers. The first time you come up with an alien, like in the Abyss, for example, I’ll give Cameron credit for that, it’s not exactly a form, but it’s more of a whisper, a cloud, or something like that.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, right. But you know what, it is hard to get people to buy into that stuff, visually.

CHRIS NEUMER: The reason why is extremely obvious.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Exactly, so I understand they have to have a humanoid appearance so we can at least identify with them. Now, micro-evolutionarily speaking, it may not make a whole lot of sense, but what are you going to do? There was this one comic book that tried to talk about stuff like that, and it had these different aliens, and one looked very, very warped, it had a lot of right angles, and you explain it, but this didn’t look cool.

CHRIS NEUMER: It comes down to that.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Exactly. That’s what I think, if it doesn’t look cool, you have to work with it, like in Men in Black, there were a lot of things.

CHRIS NEUMER: One or two?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Two. In one as well, but in two there were a lot of things that Rick Baker created that they just didn’t use, and some people said that they just didn’t understand this, or they didn’t understand that. I remember when we were pitching Underworld I got into an argument with a producer over what I wanted the werewolves to look like. He wanted them to look like — you’re familiar with Sabertooth from the X-Men, right?

CHRIS NEUMER: Sort of.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Basically, he looks like a big hairy guy.

CHRIS NEUMER: Does he have red hair and a big shaggy beard? Is he the one in the first one who chases after -?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah. They wanted the werewolves to look like that. I thought he was joking. He wanted them to have mutton chops. And I was like, no, these have to be creatures. So we just talked about it for a minute, like “Oh we can work on stuff,” “Oh, we’ll talk about it later.” But I told the director that I’m not walking into another meeting like that.

CHRIS NEUMER: Was this a well-known producer?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: No, but he was working at a pretty big company, and he was the lead on it when we were developing it. I said, “No,” and I had this werewolf built —

CHRIS NEUMER: Would I be wrong in guessing Universal?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, I can’t tell you who it is.

CHRIS NEUMER: So even if it was Universal it would still be “No.”

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Well, yeah, true it would be, but believe me, it’s not Universal. But I carried around this werewolf to every meeting we went to after that to make sure that they knew that we wanted these werewolves to be creatures; bipedal, snout-nosed creatures. After that, everyone got it, and they looked cool. They understood.

CHRIS NEUMER: Bipedal, good word. What is the word for having opposable thumbs that you can use? I’m drawing a blank now that I’m trying to think about it.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: I don’t know.

CHRIS NEUMER: I can see the picture of it in my Archeology book, but, oh well. Going back to the werewolves, one of the things that you had mentioned was that you really liked the fights, and you liked the stunts and maybe wished you could’ve had more of them, but it would’ve taken away from the story. But you’re given carte blanche, not crazy carte blanche, but you get to create some stunts that you want. What stunts did you create? What stunt or fight sequence would you like to see in a film?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: To be honest, I would like to see an all-out superhero battle.

CHRIS NEUMER: Juggernaut meets the Unstoppable?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Exactly. Mr. Immovable meets the Irresistible Force, and I would like to see an all-out superhero battle where you are basically picking up cars, throwing them across town, lifting up corners of skyscrapers. Throwing them at another superhero.

CHRIS NEUMER: Wasn’t that in the last Matrix?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: You know what, that came the closest, but —

CHRIS NEUMER: I was so tuned out by that last movie.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, but that came the closest. The first one, I guess you’d have to go back to Superman 2, with Christopher Reeve. They did the first one, but then you start doing what they do in the Matrix, that type of stuff. They didn’t throw cars; they punched through walls, and went through buildings, but to actually see that physical super-strength. Maybe eye beams, oh man! That stuff is going to be cool, once they decide they’re going to spend the money to do it. That’s what I would really like to see. Let’s face it, superhero action, that’s a part of Underworld, even though it wasn’t a comic book before, Indiana Jones was a comic book movie. So doing more of those movies like that, where you have a lot of physical conflicts is fun for me, it really is, and that’s what I like to see.

CHRIS NEUMER: I saw that in a movie too, Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: You know what? I have not been able to finish that yet.

CHRIS NEUMER: I just thought it looked like a live-action comic book.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, and it looked good. There’s another movie that I’m told is phenomenal, better than that, called Casshern, and it’s by this Japanese director who’s bringing it over here. It’s on animated DVD right now. I would like to get that, I’ve heard it has some good stuff. But seeing superhero battles is really what I’d like to see.

CHRIS NEUMER: Throwing cars, twisting skyscrapers.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Oh yeah, knocking them over, punching someone across the country, having them land and create a mile-high groove because of the power of the impact. All that stuff.

CHRIS NEUMER: Now I’m not sure I got the story on this one quite right, and again, I’m not sure if it’s something you can talk about or something you want to talk about, but what’s going on with the second Underworld, the sequel?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Basically it tells the story.

CHRIS NEUMER: Now are you associated with it?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: No, I’m not associated with that one.

CHRIS NEUMER: Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Mm.

CHRIS NEUMER: Or just a thing?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Just a thing.

CHRIS NEUMER: That might be a little worse than a bad thing.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah.

CHRIS NEUMER: That’s the part you don’t want to get into?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: It’s unfortunate. Let’s just say, it’s part of the dark side of Hollywood, I guess, things that happen. So, you know. I would still get to work on creative design, but —

CHRIS NEUMER: Wow, here’s hoping it fails miserably.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: (Laughs) no, but I wish him the best.

CHRIS NEUMER: One thing I was curious about, and you kind of touched on this earlier, when you were talking about working on the acting, but also working on the screen writing.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah.

CHRIS NEUMER: Are there any little things you’ve learned that have helped you grow and prosper? For example, one of the things I’ve found as I listened to more of the interviews that I did as I worked with more people, is that as a reporter, I have to make a conscientious effort to stop talking at some point in time. I notice that, even with some of the film critics that I deal with in Chicago, they won’t shut up. Like I’ll ask you a question, and then rather than just stop, I feel that I need to fill the void. Ironically, I’m doing it right now while describing what I’ve learned. The point is, once I learned that sort of trick of the trade, not really a trick, but something I learned, I realized I could do that. Is there anything between acting and screen writing that you’ve learned like that?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, with acting, you’re worrying about how you look, what to say, and how to say it. But really, acting is also listening.

CHRIS NEUMER: I think I’ve heard this one, I think you’ve said it somewhere else because it rings a bell, but continue.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, acting is listening, you have to learn to listen to the person you’re acting with, because the reality that you’re trying to create is born from, a lot of times, what you respond to. The best way to respond to something is to listen, and understand it on that visceral level, and that helps you a lot.

CHRIS NEUMER: Could you put that into more tangible terms, like an example of how you’d be listening?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: I guess when you’re acting with another actor they might give you certain physical clues. They might look up in the air or something. It lets you know if the scene calls for it, they may not be buying what you as an actor, as a character, are trying to tell them. So because they had that reaction to what you were saying, you have to then react, or try to explain to them. I hope that’s tangible enough.

CHRIS NEUMER: Acting is one of those things that is so hard to talk about, so much is inside your head and your heart. Actually, there’s an interview in the magazine I gave you, with Tom Jane. I have never spoken with a man, a person period, who was so able to put so much of the unspeakable parts of acting into words. So if you say something and it’s not with the most utter conviction that you could, I’m going to respond by saying, “Well…” and then you say, look, seriously, so it’s slightly improvised.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: I guess you would say that there’s a lot of improvisation on an unconscious level that occurs, and you have to be in tune with that. So all the extemporaneous stuff that you might not get to practice you need to be ready to react to, and that’s part of your listening. You’re being observant of what he’s doing. You’re also giving him as well, because there’s a reciprocity associated with it. So you have to understand the kind of mutualism, or symbiosis which occurs when you’re acting with someone else, and be conscious of that. I don’t know if that makes any sense.

CHRIS NEUMER: It does, and I’m excited about the fact that you used extemporaneous. Now I forgot, but you used three really good words in there.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: (Laughs)

CHRIS NEUMER: Symbiosis, and then something else. I always find it interesting when I talk to actors, who know things about actors, and the more you try to get noticed, the worse your performance gets.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: I guess that may be because you’re too conscious of what you look like, or how you look, or whatever, and it’s hard to separate yourself from that a lot of times. I don’t want to call it narcissistic, but [it is] in a sense. You call a rose by any other name, and it is what it is, and it’s really narcissistic.

CHRIS NEUMER: Yeah.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: But you don’t want to put a negative spin on it, but there’s a part of it that’s actually necessary.

CHRIS NEUMER: It’s also not true to the character, if you were talking like this and I was sitting here [staring off] the whole time.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, exactly. It’s interesting and it’s fun. With writing, some of the same things go into it when you’re doing dialogue, but I think a lot of that occurs within yourself. Sometimes writing can be like a window into your own personal schizophrenia. I think it’s interesting because you play all the characters, you separate all of them, and you have to be able to convey the real emotions that you want people to understand, and really absorb and I think that’s really important. So I’ve learned to listen to myself a lot of times, with writing. I also think of something a lot more simplistic is the fact that you have to learn to trust yourself with your writing. For a lot of people, that’s not a trick of the trade, but for me it is, because you always try to default to cool.

CHRIS NEUMER: Try to default to what?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Default to cool. Actors say a lot of times that you want to look for the funny in things. Well, because I’m a sci-fi fantasy guy, I like to default to the cool, what would be cool, and then you find a way —

CHRIS NEUMER: Greedo shooting first.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Huh?

CHRIS NEUMER: Greedo shooting first, that would be really cool.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: (Laughs) yeah, but even something like that. But I just have a good time with it.

CHRIS NEUMER: I’m always curious to know this, because I’ve dabbled in some writing of a fictional sense on my own. But I realize that I can’t write female characters at all, I have absolutely no idea how they think. I can’t put myself in that situation where I try to think like a female. This could be like a Paul Reiser stand-up, but it really isn’t. The connections I make, I know females just don’t. How do you put yourself into the shoes of a female to write their character?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: I guess the easy answer is that they’re human first and female second.

CHRIS NEUMER: That’s politically correct right there.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: That might be a little PC, but on another level it’s actually true. If you look at what happened with Ripley, or I should say Sigourney Weaver in Aliens, that part was originally written for a guy, but he said, well why can’t a woman play it? Now did she do anything that was necessarily female in the first Alien movie? But yet, there’s no denying she’s all woman, and reacted the way people really react. So you don’t really look at it that way. Now, if you were doing a relationship movie, like a chick flick, that may be a little different.

CHRIS NEUMER: I’m also thinking back on that line in As Good As It Gets, where the receptionist asks Jack Nicholson how he writes women so well, and Jack Nicholson says, “I take men, and then I remove accountability and reason.” But it seems like with something like Underworld, when you’re writing this it would seem imperative that Seline is not just an ass kicker like a man, but —

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Of course, but understand, I mean, your own relationships you’ve had in the past, and how women react. I mean, you’ve had enough girlfriends by this time to know women.

CHRIS NEUMER: Now that is a pull-quote.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: (Laughs) so it’s not like they’re totally alien to us, you know what I’m saying?

CHRIS NEUMER: Was there ever a thought, like throwing a nod to complaining about how tight the outfit it? There was a scene in Spiderman 2 where — you’ve seen it, correct?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yes, yes.

CHRIS NEUMER: Where he’s coming —

KEVIN GREVIOUX: No, no, I haven’t seen it. I’ve seen some of it, but not all of it.

CHRIS NEUMER: What the hell is wrong with you, I mean seriously? The first one was terrible, but the second one was —

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Here’s what it is, I don’t go to the movies.

CHRIS NEUMER: You have a DVD player though, right?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yes, but I’ve been so busy. Every Tuesday I go to the DVD store and I buy the ones I haven’t seen and then I just wait until I have a chance to watch them.

CHRIS NEUMER: So you have Spiderman 2?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: I have it, I have a lot of them, I have Hellboy, but I haven’t seen it yet. I have all the Lord of the Rings, but I haven’t seen them either. I’m busy, I just don’t have time. But when I finally get some time, then I can actually sit down and watch them and say ok, I have some time to really go over them.

CHRIS NEUMER: All right. So there was a scene in Spiderman 2, and I don’t think I’m ruining anything by saying this, Spiderman is actually taking an elevator from the roof top down to the first floor of the building, I’m not going to tell you why, just that he’s in an elevator. So another guy gets in, and there’s this scene, where it’s kind of a master shot of the two of them, and the guy looks over his shoulder, and Spiderman is in full costume. So he says, nice spidey suit, and Tobey Maguire says something like, yeah, it’s a little itchy though, and it’s kind of tight in the crotch at times. Was there ever a thought, like ever including a little knowing nod like that in Underworld, where Seline is like, I’ve been wearing these leather pants for how long now?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: You know I can’t remember, because most of my scenes weren’t with her.

CHRIS NEUMER: But in the script?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: No, no, no.

CHRIS NEUMER: Was there ever just like a little humor, or was that just too much taking the fan-boy out of the moment?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: That would be taking the fan-boy out of the moment. I think —

CHRIS NEUMER: We want Kate Beckinsdale to like wearing those pants.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: You see, but the thing is, the film is really such a collaborative effort that you really don’t know what she’s going to be wearing until you actually see it. You can describe it sometimes.

CHRIS NEUMER: But in theory you know.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah.

CHRIS NEUMER: That’s what I’m talking about.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, but you see, when I wrote my version of Underworld, I didn’t know what she wore. I was thinking all black, but I wasn’t thinking about the suit they would actually put her in.

CHRIS NEUMER: How does that work?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah…

CHRIS NEUMER: We’ll hit that one when the tape recorder is off then. I did an interview with the producer Neil Moritz; he did 2 Fast 2 Furious, XXX, basically Mountain Dew commercials for 15-year-old boys. I don’t necessarily like his movies but I have a tremendous amount of respect for what he does. I remember reading a number of reviews of the movie Torque, and they were complaining that the movie simplified women, so they were just cartoonish women with big breasts in leather. And I thought to myself, that’s the point! It seems like that’s sort of what you’re saying here, that maybe in Selene you want to create a character where someone’s like, well, maybe she would go for me, look, she’s going for him.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: I think that’s why you hire an attractive woman.

CHRIS NEUMER: Unattainability.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Well, that’s why you hire an attractive woman, marketability, what sells, blah, blah, blah. Let’s put her in something sexy, and you hope that she can carry it off, which she did very well.

CHRIS NEUMER: She did.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, she did. So you try to do things like that. So as a writer, you don’t necessarily think about things like that all the time, but there are actors who will come to you. Like I heard this one story about one actor who called the writer and asked them, well, what am I going to be wearing? It’s like, wow, I don’t know. I mean, you have an idea, but it’s not something that you can really put into words all the time. I mean I guess, what will you be wearing? Heavy soled boots?

CHRIS NEUMER: And lots of petticoats.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: I wrote this one script and I am having a hard time trying to figure out what kind of military outfits they’re going to wear, because this is in the future.

CHRIS NEUMER: Don’t make them all silver.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: No, no, no, believe me. We were just talking about that, trying to come to an agreement.

CHRIS NEUMER: When you work with it, I can see that. If you’re not able to compromise, I can see how this would be the worst industry in the world.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, because it’s rough. Someone told me that Brad Pitt appeared in a comic adventure of some sort, and someone had said something to the effect of, what can a person do to get into this industry? And Brad Pitt said, don’t.

CHRIS NEUMER: Yeah, I love it when people ask questions like that. It’s like, hey, Kevin, man, I saw you in Underworld, how do I go about doing this? You’re like, well, let’s see, it only took me eight years, so, start working. I mean, I have people come up to me all the time and say, hey, how do I go about publishing a magazine? I’m like, you just do it, that’s it. You work at it.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: But you know what, no one wants to hear that answer, and that’s actually the answer.

CHRIS NEUMER: Go to the Starbucks at Wilshire and Labret, or something like that, and sit there until some agents from William-Morris come into the Starbucks, and then do this —

KEVIN GREVIOUX: But you know what, everyone thinks there’s this secret formula that insiders have.

CHRIS NEUMER: There is – lots of work and talent.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, but I will say this much, you mentioned tricks of the trade. There are those, and I think that’s what people are actually looking for, because everything else is in books. But it’s like, ok, don’t give me the coffee table answer. What is the real way you get into the business?

CHRIS NEUMER: I gave it 100 percent, showed up everyday. It was really a team effort.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, because I remember trying to get into comic books, way before Underworld. Talking to some industry people, people I admired, and they gave me the cookie-cut answers. And it’s like, no, there is another way. And you know what? I’m doing it now.

CHRIS NEUMER: Do you tell people not to answer that way? I’ve actually started to do that, when people start talking, not you particularly, but when someone says, it was great working with them, I say no, that’s a bunch of crap, I don’t want to hear that, try again. Let’s hear it again, let’s try the answer that you didn’t give Entertainment Weekly.

KEVIN GREVIOUX: No, I have not tried that. But there are some people you know you can approach like that, and others you can’t. There are some, like with the comic book industry, there are some people who are cool, and some people who aren’t cool, and the thing is —

CHRIS NEUMER: That can just be generalized everywhere, though, can’t it?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, believe it or not, man, it is. Until you get with an industry professional who says, look, here’s what it is, the best thing you can do is don’t give me the answer, oh, a writer writes, write everyday, read everything. No. What you need is to find yourself an artist, you need to find your best idea, and you two need to collaborate and put something out.

CHRIS NEUMER: This is comic books?

KEVIN GREVIOUX: Yeah, this is comic books. Just supposing this though, with the standard cookie-cut answer, this is what they really need to have. This is what you need to do, once you get that done, and then you show it to this person. Now that’s a lot more informative than, oh, you have to work hard, write and read everything, blah, blah, blah. You need to know this. I need something a little bit more specific. It’s kind of like you have to be a guidance counselor. When they really come to ask you that question, be a guidance counselor.